The Data-Driven Acquisitions Playbook: Tracking and Optimizing Performance

"Aaron Chris super excited to dig into Acquisitions with you guys. Figure out what you're doing. Obviously, you're locking up a ton of contracts. Anybody who follows Aon on Instagram has seen Chris more than a few times ringing bells and all that kind of stuff. Chris, you're the... what do we call you? A senior Acquisitions manager here? Been here for about as long as anybody, which means a year?"

"Yeah, in the context of this business, which is a fun stage. It's the growth stage where you're just kind of figuring out how those things work. I've been there too, and I'm kind of there now. A lot of the people in my company who've been there for the longest are like two years."

"Okay, how long have you been around?"

"Six years."

"So just like you, I was kind of running around in circles for a while, didn't know anything, and then started to level up over time. It's like technically we've been around for six years, but those early years... those early years I was an idiot. They don't count."

"Yeah, that's why we're making this, you know, because I want to help somebody who's just one or two steps behind what you are in your business right now. There's a lot of people out there trying to build a seven-figure wholesaling company, so we can talk about what that looks like. And positions, obviously that's the spotlight of all real estate investment. I just talked with Michaela and Stephanie. We talked about dispositions, which is kind of underrated a lot. Obviously, dispositions are crazy important. I love the focus that you guys put on that."

"Well, they wouldn't have anything to do if it weren't for this guy right here."

"Right, so anyways, let's talk about Acquisitions. I'd love to get into some of the details and everything. First, let's talk high-level metrics. How do you measure the performance of Acquisitions of the company and what does that look like?"

"There are a bunch of things now. You know, a lot of us have read the book 'Traction,' right? A lot of us didn't like it, and I actually made a video on my Instagram not too long ago where I basically said, 'If you read the book 'Traction' and you didn't like it, it's because you don't have a team.' You got to have a team to really understand it and relate to the book. You have to have the problems that the book solves, which are all the problems that you get not when you don't have a team, but when you have a team and it's not working."

"So one thing we use from that book is the People Analyzer. We actually just implemented this recently, and I have it on a spreadsheet. We have core values as our title, and then we have the plus and minus. We evaluate each individual by month to our core values. If it's a negative, and all the people that have left us, I've looked at the People Analyzer and we saw that they were in the red and they were never a good fit."

"We also do a scorecard that's in the book. That's just four to five things that we want to see because you monitor it per week. You know, how many leads did you get assigned? How many contracts? How many closes? How much revenue?"

"What we do monitor is some of our KPIs. We want two contracts a week. It's not too crazy, but with our type of leads that we're getting, PPC, that's not a hard task to really come up with. So we want two contracts a week. That's eight contracts a month. With that being said, contracts are going to fall out, but with a strong disposition team, obviously our close rate's gone up. So then we kind of want to cut that in half, and we want about five deals closing the following month."

"We want to average nationwide right now about 12 to 15 thousand. If it's in our backyard, it's a little bit more, but we want at least about 12 to 15,000. So you could do the math. We want $80,000 per rep per month. And then obviously if they go off track, we figure out okay, what's going on? And you figure that out by the scorecard."

"For example, I had one of my reps... you might hear this, but I think it's a great example. We saw on the scorecard how many offers have gone out. If we're not hitting our contract goal, I'll see how many offers have gone out. So you just do backwards, right?"

"It's funny. So we were looking at... I had my one-on-ones, and we do two one-on-ones every single month. I call them coaching calls. They're like mentor-coach, and I actually have right here on my whiteboard: 'Stop doing, start mentoring, coaching, and recruiting.' That's been my kind of job now since I'm not the one calling the leads."

"So what I want to do is I want to coach them. So we look at a scorecard, and I was looking at one of our guys. He's crushing it, but I looked back and I said, 'Hey, we didn't hit our contract goal for the week.' I think he got like one contract, and I said, 'All right, so let's see where it was going wrong.' I saw that he made little offers. We compared them to other acquisition reps. He made little offers, and I thought it was a typo."

"In fact, I go to my admin, and I was like, 'Hey, what's happening here? I think...' And then I think Michaela was in on the meeting, and she said, 'No, those are the right numbers.' So I looked at my acquisition guy and said, 'All right, we need to start making more offers.' Literally the next week, he made more offers and got six contracts in that week."

"Hopefully, I answer your question. Those are a couple ways that we evaluate our acquisition reps."

"I think the only thing to add is we like to look at the talk time as well, and quality conversations. People can be making these dials but not really having these quality conversations, which is what we're all looking for. So tracking that is super important, and that usually reflects into the talk time. If you're having good quality conversations, they're 10 minutes or more, and we want the longer talk time. The more likely you are to get that offer."

"That's super neat. Something that I always have to remind myself of is you pay based on the result, you hold people accountable to the process. Sounds like you're talking a lot about holding accountable to the process, right? Because a lot of people, like I have clients that will say, 'I don't need to do that stuff because I pay them commission, so they should do all that anyways.'"

"Which sounds good until you actually go through it and realize it doesn't happen. People won't do what's in their best interest if they're not held accountable to it. Like somebody who wants to quit smoking can want to quit smoking so they don't get cancer. That doesn't mean they're going to do it because people need help accomplishing their goals."

"One thing that just popped up, and something that I'm always trying to get better at, is a deeper why. I think that really goes into because I'm here to be a servant to my team, right? And I'm going to always try to do my best to be a servant. And by doing that, if they don't hit their numbers, you know what? Again, what we're always trying to focus on is okay, if we didn't hit our numbers, do you remember that you wanted to do X? Do you remember you wanted to hit this goal, this target?"

"And if you put it in that aspect of obviously, this is not about... because we give you commission for XYZ, but it's like why? That commission is for something. We all want to make money, but why do we want to make the money? The money is for a deeper why. Why we're all here... I know you said you had a ping pong table at your office, but we always make a joke here that we don't have a ping pong table here because you're here for a purpose."

"You're here to kick some butt, to go back out to the world to fulfill your deeper why. So when you're here, it's all about business, kicking mass and butt, being ruthless, having resilience, having ownership, and then that accountability that we just talked about. So we're always really trying to dig into that deeper why, and obviously, I could always do better, and I'm always trying to get better at that."

"And we found like the best people, I mean, we all know the top performers, they want to be held accountable. So like, yes, they should be doing that for their best interest, but any top performer wants to keep that, track those numbers. I mean, I want to be... you know, I want to beat my numbers last week. So I want to be able to see that, keep myself accountable. We all slip sometimes, but it's important to visualize that."

"And I think it's for me, it's been one of my favorite things of looking at that in our morning huddles. We're seeing our numbers. This week has been tough for me. I haven't been able to hit those numbers, but today's going to be different. It's a conversation that we're constantly having, and if you don't track those things, they fall through the cracks."

"Totally understood. One of those numbers in my industry that's usually really important is how many leads does it take for us to get a contract? Obviously, all those other things contribute to that, right? We got to be making dials, be having talk time, stuff like that. What do you guys find is realistic and how do you set that benchmark for what realistic is?"

"I'm going to let him... Well, I know just based off of the conversation I've had with Aaron, I think the amount of your question was how many leads it takes to get to a contract, right? For us, our minimum is like we have 75 dials. If you don't have 75 dials, if you have a contract, you need to be including getting more dials. But I think right now what we're at is 12 leads to a contract, 10 to 12 leads to a contract, something like that."

"Yeah, one thing we always look for, and this is something Chris really embodies, and there's two things, and that's a good attitude and hard work. And that's why he stuck around with us for so long. He has a good attitude and hard work. It's funny, Chris, being... you know, we went from a small office to a larger office, starting to build that team, starting to build that culture that we talk about."

"And so, let's just... long story short, that small office and small team that we had is no longer with us. The one person that is with us is Chris, and you got to kind of see some of that growth. I remember when we were with that small team, we had to ask for grace because a lot of things were changing. We were growing, we were bringing on... Brandon, just kidding. We were bringing in... it's really when we started working together, that's when everybody quit."

"Yep, they missed the boat, man. They missed it."

"There was definitely a lot of accountability that the old team couldn't handle. I'm sure you as a business owner have felt that as well. But the cool thing is now, and I've heard one of my mentors say this, and he's like, 'I've never had to fire anybody.' And I was like, 'What do you mean you have not had to fire anybody?'"

"If your standards are high and your values are there, and they're not meeting up to your standard, you just have to ask them a simple question, and usually they unfortunately and fortunately leave on their own. So I had to fire somebody... actually, a good couple months now, they just quit. They just quit because obviously, we're looking for excellence."

"It's kind of like when I look for candidates and I got 20 candidates coming a day, which we are doing, as I was explaining to you earlier. Obviously, we're looking for the best of the best, and so obviously our hiring process has gotten a lot better. Chris has been a great right-hand guy to really help and filter those people, hold those people's standards high, really embody our core values."

"We, he and I, get to collaborate and talk about a lot of times when people come in. We realize that our sales process... every company should have a sales process, and we have a sales process. And we've seen people who don't embody the sales process, and they want to go cowboy stuff. Crash and burn hard. But if they could come in and they could have a growth mindset and they embody our sales process and bring in the value, obviously their skill set, the reason why we hired them, they're able to skyrocket and start hitting their numbers quick for sure."

"Oh, that's super cool. Chris, I'd love to ask you what that process looks like. Let's start at the very beginning. So, PPC lead comes in. How do you even know that that happened and what happens next?"

"Yeah, no, so first off, we all get a notification. Everybody on the sales team gets a notification. We kind of... it's a thing that we do here at the office because of Aaron. When something comes in, new lead, we all just kind of like to say it. Just one of those culture things."

"Urgency, baby. Like you come here for the first day, you're like, 'What is everybody doing?' Then after a year, you're like, 'This is just life. This is how it goes.'"

"Exactly. And I mean, even on some of the things that I've seen, videos that you made, it's speed to lead, right? It's a big thing that we have. We want to get to it as fast as possible. So I mean, me and Jonathan out there, we're fighting to get them on the line. But once we get them onto the line, then we just start going through our sales process, asking them the four pillars of motivation, trying to really dig deep and see if this is going to be a good fit and how we can really help."

"So that's pretty much it, but I think the main thing is speed to lead, just like getting them on the phone as fast as possible. I mean, we get the notification and we're dialing them three times back to back, me and Jonathan, right now."

"So different numbers?"

"Oh yeah, multiple tries. We're blowing them up constantly."

"You'd say the most important part of your sales process is what happens within the first few minutes of coming in?"

"Seconds. Seconds. And that's honestly something... like every time we go... because you guys, according to our whole client metrics, you stack up pretty well in terms of Acquisitions performance. It's part of the reason I'm here. If you guys really sucked, you wouldn't have this conversation, right? So you do well. So I have faith that what you're talking about is really real, really true."

"And every other conversation I've had like this, that is such a huge piece of the process. I think people struggle to actually tangibly make it happen. What would you say, and this question is for either of you, if we're talking about speed to getting to new leads, have you ever had a time where you struggled with that before? Like, was there a time where you weren't performing, or have you just always had this down?"

"I could say for me, no. Like, I think it goes down to what he was saying earlier, like the deeper why. Like when a lead comes in, it's not necessarily like, 'Oh, a lead just came in.' That's something that's going to put food on the table, right? That to get me to my next goal. So it's like, if you have to have that in you, and once you see that, it's... that's money ringing, you know?"

"And knowing what happens on the back end, we're fortunate enough to have somebody to kind of fill us in on those things. We spend a lot of money for these types of leads, so we need to take care of them. It's not something that we just throw off and like, 'Oh, I'll get to it later.' Like, you shouldn't really be here if that's your mindset, you know?"

"Yeah, so it sounds like for you, you're saying a big piece of this in your opinion is the right person with the right motivation. They're fast to get to the leads, not necessarily... and maybe like we say, like hold accountable to the process, that's important, right?"

"Right, but the right person theoretically would be motivated themselves to do that."

"100%. That's the culture that we're bringing in here as well. Like, we want them to be able to come in here and have that type of motivation. We're going to hold them to those standards, but yeah, I mean, you're getting a high dollar, high-value lead that just came in. You better be on that."

"Yeah, what did you do before this, Chris?"

"Here, I've been a realtor for going on four years now. So I was doing real estate, doing a lot of investments as well."

"Were you really connected to this deeper why before you started working here?"

"Yeah, yeah. I know definitely before real estate. I mean, I was in the restaurant industry. I was a server. Always had real estate on my mind. But yeah, I've always had large goals, and I feel like, you know, we all know real estate is one of the driving forces to build that generational wealth and get that cycle of poverty out of your family tree. So yeah, that's always been my deeper why. You have to... I feel like in sales, if you don't have a why, you're going to... you're in for a treat 'cause you go through it, you know? You go through those roller coasters, and if you don't have anything to anchor you, you're not going to last."

"Yeah, no, it's super... that's super fair. It's very interesting. So speed to lead and then the four pillars?"

"Yeah, so there's two things. One thing what I like actually... so last month our contact rate was a little off. One thing I really liked is you got to surround yourself and you got to build a team that actually gives a crap, cares, has passion for these leads. Chris, he saw that and he was like almost hurt, and he said, 'I don't like that.' And he got the other acquisition guy together and said, 'All right, let's pound these leads. Let's get in contact with these leads.' So that's something too that obviously fires me up."

"One thing too is obviously you want to use technology to get us fast, fast to these leads as possible. So we have a CRM that when a lead comes in, it sends an automatic text to them within like zero seconds. They submit, they get a text. Always going to be faster than a human could possibly be, even in the best of scenarios. And the text literally says, 'Hey, I saw you fill out a form. I'm calling you right now if you find an unknown number.'"

"Right, and I know you know that message, but it's a really great idea as long as you actually do it. Otherwise, you set the stage for how bad you are at doing what you say you're going to do from minute number one. So obviously that goes out to them, and then we obviously want to contact the lead in 60 seconds or less."

"One thing we did talk about, I know a lot of people talk about this a lot, is obviously nights and weekends, right? You know, that's probably where the contact rate goes down a little bit, and that's fine. But when we're in office, you know, that's like I said, we're here from 8 to 5, and we still keep those leads going after hours because we know the cost per lead's still great. So that's another thing too, is keep it on after hours even when people are still living their deeper whys, living their life, and that's fine. Obviously, we just really require them to answer the phones here, and we're really good at that."

"So speed to lead, boom, they answer it, and then it's also a sales process of already assuming that that lead's ready to go, that seller is ready to go, right? It's not a cold call, text lead, some type of cold marketing. That's why we love these leads because you could lock them up on the first call if possible. So that's another thing too, is you got to know how to talk to these leads or you're going to waste a lot of money."

"Absolutely. Do you know how many days it takes to get a lead under contract? I mean, do you have the stat like average or median?"

"Yeah, it's three to five days. Unless they, like I said, unless they get the lead on the first call."

"Yeah, fair enough. Which happens pretty often, right? They come in, we get on the phone with them within seconds, we're on the call with them for 45 minutes, an hour and a half, and we get the contract right there."

"When you say pretty often, are we talking like is this 10% of your contracts, 30%?"

"I wouldn't be able to say it's... I wouldn't know the actual numbers, but it's definitely up there. It's probably like 40%."

"Okay, so that's like almost as much as you get?"

"Yeah, it happens weekly. There's... I believe, and I think Jonathan's at that stage as well, if I get a PPC lead that is ready to go, they're ready to go, and I get on the phone with them, we're locking it up right there. Like, it's no question about it. I have the confidence in what we do that that's what's happening. There's other factors, right? If they... there's a bunch of things that they can't sign right then and there, which is kind of out of our control. But if we get on the phone with them, we're locking it up."

"It's funny, we have training every single day. Like two... let me see if I remember. I actually have a spreadsheet. Good job, they keep me accountable. For everybody's information, the reason the spreadsheet thing coming up is 'cause I learned that that's a phony. He's a phony, apparently. Michaela... yeah, this certificate of graduation. It's half my wife, half my wife. Apparently, Michaela did the spreadsheets class, not fully Aaron. But you learned the skills after college?"

"That's right, that's right. It's still worth it. And so I do hold myself accountable. Actually, I do do spreadsheets because it's my life data. Did I go to the gym today? And I literally track what I do. Anyways, on my trainings, so like yesterday was call out. Today's role play. Thursday, I forgot what Thursday is. And then Friday's like comp training. And I make sure I do that. I try to do that every day if I can."

"And I'll put 'Yes, I did it.' Anyways, today was supposed to be roleplay. Matter of fact, I held off roleplay because I thought maybe we'd get that on recording because I wanted to show you. Because what we do, and I didn't because I know that was part of what the email you sent me, but one thing we do with these leads is, again, when you talk, when you negotiate, you got to create urgency, maybe a little bit of scarcity. That's how you get those one-call closes, right?"

"By not moving forward with an actual close until you know they're actually fresh and hot and ready, and then you could go in and take them out of the oven and eat them. But I think that's to their point of another... the earlier question that you asked, like why these leads are so important is because a lot of them, there's a possibility that you're going to get them under contract right then and there. So like that, I feel like in itself should be the number one reason why you get on there as quickly as possible, or else they're going to call me and I'm going to do it. So that's a big, big factor for sure."

"Yeah, I totally agree. You said, Aaron, that you're basically not trying to do business with these people until like you verify that it's right. Can't remember exactly what words you said. And I've heard... just know I'm coming at this from like the 'never been in a seller's house' situation. So I'm just really curious to dig deeper into it because I've heard a lot of different things from different people."

"Like one person we both know is Cody Hofhine. Love Cody. Their team is also one of our top performers over time. They have this rule where like, they don't make offers basically. And basically what Mark says is... Mark is Cody's business partner... he says like, 'I'm not in the business of making offers, I'm in the business of doing deals.' So it's a lot of like hypothetical, like, 'Okay, well, so it sounds like if I could get you that amount of money, you might be interested in putting a deal together today.' And like, but I'm not like saying, 'This is my number' or something like that."

"But I also know that making offers is something that you guys track. Like, what's your mindset on this? Because some people are in the camp of like, the more offers you make, the more deals I do, for sure. And other people are in the camp of, 'I'm not going to make an offer unless I know it's going to be accepted for sure, and I want to hold my number close because if I put my number out there, then they have what they want from me and they won't care about me anymore.' Where are you guys at and how do you do your process?"

"So I guess when it comes to offer, it's not necessarily... let me rephrase it and give it the definition of an offer. An offer is not saying, 'Hey Brandon, I'm going to give you $30,000 for this house, take it or leave it.' That's not an... I wouldn't call that an offer in our sales process. It's more of a, you know, did we get to the numbers part? Did we have the full process? Got... maybe there was no like official offer given. It was just, did we talk about... exactly, did we get to the full... did we talk about that?"

"And you know, do we give a... or like, did we talk about ranges? Did we talk about what another investor might pay for something like this? We always use third parties."

"Yeah, that makes sense. No, that absolutely makes sense. I'm curious to talk about lead managers. Obviously, Chris, these leads come in, you're going right to them. And different people have different ways of building their business. I know, Aaron, you and I both know a lot of people that are fans of using lead managers in their business. Tell me about what went into your choice to not have a lead manager in between the marketing and Acquisitions."

"Oh yeah, that's... not a fan of lead managers. Now obviously, there are different types of, you know, philosophies out there. Some people use VAs, some people call them Junior Acquisitions, some people call them lead managers, but they're in the US, American side. There's a huge range of quality, those few things that you mention."

"100%. And for me, like when I'm hiring, especially at the size of my company right now, when I'm hiring, I'm looking for closers. Like, I want a closer. If I'm dealing with inbound marketing, I want closers. Now obviously, the lead comes in, it goes to maybe a lead manager to do follow-up. I think the amount of passing around a lead loses its... loses its warmth of that lead."

"Somebody... 'cause how I see it, if I mean, you're here from 8 to 5, you're in the office 8 to 5, you're going through your CRM, you're calling... you know, we're... you could be calling over 100 a day, just trying to get somebody on the phone some days. And then also they got their follow-up, they got their pipe. We do a lot of pipeline pickups. We're always figuring out what leads are in the end zone. They're doing the exact same thing a lead manager would do, and that's following up, trying to find leads in the CRM, closing deals."

"So they're doing the same exact thing as a lead manager would do. So basically when you ask me why don't you get a lead manager, it's because that's my acquisition guy already. They're the ones going through the pipe, they're looking through the CRM for leads, they're doing their follow-up. And also with their follow-up, they're able to follow up with each... their pipe to build the overtime relationship because our fallout game is strong."

"So I just don't see a point. I mean, they're making over 100 calls a day some days unless they're having great long quality conversations to get contracts or appointments or whatever. But I just... I mean, if I had them on the field maybe every day and they were going house to house, maybe that would make sense. If we're just kind of shooting the crap here, maybe that would make sense because now they're not on the phones going through it. But we're very good at closing deals over the phone. That's like our... that's our... that's the way we do things here. We close the deal over the phone."

"So they're just... they're going through... they're on the phone all day anyways. But yeah, if they're at the house, that might make a little more sense. What are your thoughts?"

"Yeah, no, and I think it makes it easier for what... like doing how we do it is because we have a system and process in place so that we know how to properly manage the leads. Like, it goes back again, taking extreme ownership. The top performers are going to have a clean pipe. They're going to have a clean CRM to look at every day, know how to manage those specific leads, what's hot, what's warm, what's cold."

"So yeah, I mean, we do it... we take ownership of our leads once we get ownership of those leads. So yeah, I think it makes it a lot easier of knowing how to properly do it and manage them day to day."

"Yeah, that makes sense. And I don't disagree with you guys. I'm just going to play Devil's Advocate."

"Well, I mean, we're... it's a very... in our industry, it's a very controversial topic, right? A lot of people say, 'Oh, you... why... you need a lead manager. What are you talking about?' You know, and just something I don't agree with."

"Well, you're the... yeah, you're the weird guy, I think, in this overall. Ironically, a lot of the clients that I've spoken to that are our highest performers, for the most part, don't use lead managers on the front end. Sometimes on the back end when leads go cold or something, for sure. We could talk about that as, you know, a separate thing."

"So I think you're unusual amongst the industry as a whole, but pretty common amongst some of our most successful clients. But that considered, I'm curious... back when you were doing tons of cold calling, texting, did you have lead managers at that point?"

"I did. You did? I had a VA lead manager, one and two actually."

"Okay, yeah. So the journey of what you've done is actually pretty similar to a lot of people, because what people notice is a lead manager is there to shield Acquisitions from all the crap you get from marketing. That's essentially their job, because Acquisitions people get really demotivated when they deal with bad lead after bad lead after bad lead. It's not actually motivated."

"But when they use bait... man, collect... we know all these leads are quality, man. They're quality."

"You... uh, I'm glad you remember the script, Chris. That's awesome. I was worried you wouldn't come in at the right time. That's super good. No, like, it's true though. If you need 40 or 60 or 80 leads to a contract, then that's a lot of work to filter through those. If you have 10 or 12... I'm curious because like, you still get... like sometimes we work with teams that are used to having a lead manager, and then they take it out and they're like, 'Oh no, this lead has the wrong phone number.' Like, as an Acquisitions manager, I feel super offended, and like, this... I should never have to deal with this or something."

"I'm sure you get... like, everybody gets that kind of stuff. Like, usually about 15% of leads are complete bogus in some way or another. And then, you know, you work down the funnel, some are better than others. Not all leads are created equal, we know that for sure, right? But how do you feel about like the spread of quality that you get? Do you feel like it's too much and you end up wasting a lot of time with leads that aren't as good, or does it feel like a productive use of your time?"

"No, yeah, no, definitely not. Most of our leads are quality, and you know, we don't have a lead manager, but like, for instance, if we have a lead that has a wrong phone number, we just pushed it to a VA. 'Hey, skip trace this lead,' and she puts the right phone numbers in. I put it in my follow-up for the next day and call with the right number. I mean, and I just keep moving on to the ones that have the right number. It's just super simple. It's not that hard."

"So yeah, now I think that we have some... the quality leads, and we're... yeah, we're doing pretty well. We had... so I was doing... I did an interview... were you on the interview?"

"Yeah, I think it was you."

"So he... so I'll have a shadow day, and I'll have a guy come in. And this guy came from the solar industry, and what he did is he went door knocking. And what he would do is he would like set up... like he'd be like a lead manager. He would set up for the closer, and then he'd get somebody... you know, guy opens, 'Yes, I would like solar.' He'd call his closer, and he would come over and close the deal."

"So anyway, so I guess I don't know, the guy maybe didn't like solar or something, so he applied for here. And I kind of liked him. He seemed like a sharp dude, sharp individual. Young, young, young individual. Anyways, comes in here, you know, we... he goes through the whole normal shadow day, goes in for our roleplay exercise that we do, part of that... part of our exercise. And I do... I do bring Chris, and I... and sometimes I'll bring either or just to kind of give me a second opinion when we bring somebody on the team."

"And we go through a roleplay, and every single time after the roleplay, he would always say, 'Hey, do you want... okay, so Mr. Seller, would you like me to have somebody call you?' He couldn't get over the fact of setting it up. So what we do is we pause the roleplay. We'll coach him and we'll tell him like, 'Hey, I know that's what you do, but I need you to be able to close the deal.'"

"And so we... so right, let's go again.

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